theres no point to argue about this, Quake 4 is already out and everybody can play it and have their own opinion, thats just the way it is, some people somehow were dissapointed by Half Life 2 or Doom 3 and honestly i dont know what they were expecting from these games but to me they were worth the wait, yet theres people that didnt like them, like a friend of mine, he rather play Buffy the vampire slayer on PS2 or Xbox and then said that Doom 3 and F.E.A.R suck big time and well i guess you know what my thoughts were since i like both games :thumbup: but i think ill never play Buffy even if it comes out with the PS3 graphics now that i know a bit more about Quake 4 and the multiplayer rocks for what i read here, ill get it sooner that i thought, i used to play Quake III Arena alot and i hope to see you guys online or maybe gamershell can set up a server for us :P