Lair Reviewer's guide

Originally posted by Gazz@Sep 11 2007, 05:38 PM
Well, I could have responded to your previous post, but I like your last better so I'll respond to that one. I was still right about all my points but there is no point in boosting my ego on that one, everybody knows Gazz is always right :P No need in continuing this flaming back and forward when we could adress this point which I am right about too.

1) It's highly unlikely that MS had survived if it would have released it's console at the same time as Sony's PS3. The Xbox 1 (which I liked) had been discontinued from support at that time and we all know that consoles only get discontinued if they are not commercially successful (enough).With the PS3 in the market at that time it wouldn't have sold have the consoles it did now and the reliability issues wouldn't have been forgiven that easily as they have been done now. I actually think that the 360 will never pass the 25 million mark if it gets to that point at all.

2) Sony has tons of mayor titles coming out this Christmas, but they have them coming out on PS2 and PSP, not on PS3 unfortunatly. Both PS2 and PSP are still doing great , just for reference some game (translated loosely as) “Another Century’s Episode 3: The Final� has sold around 230.000 copies in a single week in Japan, a single week! Also, the web is buzzing with rumours about a 40 gb PS priced at 399 to be released around Christmas too, linky. Also, it's rumoured the PS2 will drop to 99 dollars and the new PSP slim is just about to be released, it also brought PSP sales to an all time low this month as everyone is waiting for the slim version. It's also quite debatable wether Halo will really attract that many new customers or if all Halo fans already bought a 360 in these last few years in anticipation.

3) Nintendo rules, I am not a fan of their console, hell I even sold mine after 2 weeks but they sure make gaming more socially acceptable. The market is way big enough for the 2 players, gaming has made a huge popularity boost and the number of gamers have immensely grown. Comparing the Nintendo/Sega market to today's market is impossible.

Hey, I used the word also alot in this post

1). If M$ waited as long to release the 360 as SONY did to release the PS3, it is very unlikely that it would have such major design flaws. It would also have an internal HD unit of some specification or other.

2). Yes they do and as you have said, none of them are AAA titles for PS3. Selling 250k copies of a game, not relevant to the current market is not going to please SONY an awful lot. Halo3 will surpass that by a factor of 10 on launch day. This is the kind of income from software sales that SONY needs.

3). Yes Nintendo do rule, but the Wii is not a gamers' console. It is more appealing to a wider, less hardcore, crowd of people. Nintendo's sales are not representative of the same market that M$ and SONY actively target.

Originally posted by Gm2â„¢@Sep 11 2007, 06:47 PM
1). If M$ waited as long to release the 360 as SONY did to release the PS3, it is very unlikely that it would have such major design flaws. It would also have an internal HD unit of some specification or other.

2). Yes they do and as you have said, none of them are AAA titles for PS3. Selling 250k copies of a game, not relevant to the current market is not going to please SONY an awful lot. Halo3 will surpass that by a factor of 10 on launch day. This is the kind of income from software sales that SONY needs.

3). Yes Nintendo do rule, but the Wii is not a gamers' console. It is more appealing to a wider, less hardcore, crowd of people. Nintendo's sales are not representative of the same market that M$ and SONY actively target.

1) Most likely it would not have the flaws it has today, but the competition of another console being released at the same time would have been a disaster for MS. They didn't rush their product just for the fun of it.

2) The current market consists of games and consoles that are currently being sold and produced. This game I mentioned fits right into that category and so do all other PS2/PSP games that are in the top selling list of this week/month, whatever you prefer. The money made from those titles is way more then MS makes if you look at the fact that MS has only lost on their console to date and has to make up for that before making a profit and even Halo won't change that. It will most likely just lead to more overheated 360's like Bioshock did and continues to do so ( )

3) Agree. I just pointed out that they are making gaming more acceptable to the masses.

Gazz, you keep talking about profit. What you are missing is that MS is willing to BUY market share at the expense of profit, and that is what is crushing Sony. MS will subsidise the cost of games/console systems to gain market share, and if that means buying dev houses (Bungee anyone?) to gain exclusive access to big games, so what? They can throw BILLIONS around. This isn't a new tactic by MS, it is exactly how they took over the web browser market by pusing out IE for free, and they are well practiced at it.

Without new AAA titles for the PS3 this Christmas where do you think consumers who want a shiny new console will go? They really only have one option for the highly publicized AAA titles. This is going to leave Sony even further behind on shipped units, making the 360 even more attractive to developers, allowing MS to garner more exclusive content, etc, etc

As far as abandoning the original Xbox... well, I don't see how keeping both in distribution would have been any benefit to MS, and I'm not sure that keeping the PS2 is really helping out SONY any. Generally, companies try pretty hard not to have competing products on the market, and I can't help but think that having PS2 and PS3 both out at the same time isn't a tad confusing to your average Christmas shopper.

I imagine Sony will be fine in the handheld market for some time to come, it's just them and Nintendo, and they have a lot of titles for it coming down the pike.

Sure MS is willing to buy marketshare, but shareholders are starting to get fed up with it and that's not a good sign. Losing revenue per share is not a good thing in grey suit country, the only game they are interested in is that of money and they play to win as much as possible in a short period. Sony needs to make profit more then MS does for sure, but that doesn't mean that MS is still in the days of just spending anymore, that's in the past.

Everyone keeps saying that Sony is going down, but it has been able to withstand the pressure rather excellent up till now, they only made a loss in 1 quarter of this year and the web is filled with people spelling doomsday for Sony and it's console. The truth is that it's doing fine, sales have been matching the launchdata of the 360 exactly even while it's in a market that does have another console as competition. That's pretty amazing in my book.

I even would go as far as saying that with the expected price cut the PS3 won't be falling back that far. I think it's going to draw a whole lot of gamers who found it too expensive at first over the line and get the PS3. Sure some AAA titles would help, but I think games like Heavenly sword and Unreal tournament (that's AAA) will do fine for now.

The PS2 is helping Sony out in the shape of cold hard cash. They cut down on production costs and even make a small profit on each sold unit. On top of that they already have tons of graphic engines for the PS2 and can produce games fast and with a lot of profit. It also sold over 105 million consoles and that's a market you can't ignore.

The DS and PSP aren't really comparable just like the Wii and PS3,360 aren't. They are both handhelds and that's about it.

Edit: Gran turismo prolouge is coming out before Christmas and so are Ratchet and clank and time crisis 4. With Gran turismo alone it will sell a huge shitload in consoles.
I am aware that GT really isn't that great but neither is Halo. It just has a big name and is overhyped and that's all that matters in today's mtv culture right?

M$ Shareholders love M$, because most of M$ Shareholders work at M$. M$ continue to buy up things left, right and centre, it is the way they work. Where you get your idea that it is in the past is beyond me. What they spent last financial year within the game division is miniscule in comparison to what they spent acquiring software technologies and companies...

... I live in and around M$ UK and am regularly there on courses and in seminars. You will not believe how greedy they are and the absolute mind-numbing amount of money they regularly spunk up the wall.

LET'S BEAT UP GM!! and then GAZZ

Originally posted by KamisoriX@Sep 12 2007, 06:16 AM
LET'S BEAT UP GM!! and then GAZZ

Gazz and GM join forces to kick Kami in the nuts.

MS gave out shares of it's company to employees a long time ago didn't it? Made a lot of them millionaires. However, most of them have sold their stocks and more and more of those are starting to fall into the hands of private investors or investment companies. Not that long ago MS was notorious for making acquisitions of all kinds without having to worry about it financially but they do now that they are being watched by tons of organisation's. Their anti trust judgement is most likely to be renewed ( linky) which will keep their hands tied for a long time and European rules are tightning around their neck as well. In fact, there's a final hearing ruling in supreme court about a fine issued for abusing it's monopoly status that most likely will not rule in favour of ms. With that fine will also come harder restrictions for them, this is the fine I am talking about.

MS has lost the search engine war to Google, the videosite war to Youtube, the MP3 market to Apple, it's keyboard and mouse line is only doing moderatly well, it's slowly losing market share on the browser market, it's just been beaten by Nintendo that took the first place in the console market and thanks to Ubuntu in particular, Linux is slowly gaining momentum amongst IT enthusiasts and professionals. Vista has been getting a shitload of complaints and lost a lot of customer goodwill and several branch organisation's have been looking into the legitimacy of how MS forced pc builders to use their os instead of an alternative, mostly by asking higher prices to manufacturers who also used Linux or something similar. The 360 turns out to have mayor design issues, scratches discs, overheats and hardly seems to have any mayor exclusive titles for next year that won't be coming to PC or PS3. The fact that it has been the only high def console that's been cracked and piracy numbers are starting to become huge on the 360 sure doesn't persuade developers to continue to devlop exclusively for them anymore. The only thing keeping them "loyal" are the big sacks of money MS throws at them right now like the 50 million at take two but that will end soon too. Ms won't go down, we both know that, but it's starting to show more and more cracks in it's once polished buildings.

Also, more and more developers are starting to turn their heads into the direction of online storage instead of on the desktop itself. Ajaxwindows for example still needs a whole lot of work and then some, but at least it shows potential and MS seems to completely ignore this direction. I sure see a lawsuit coming from the MS for using the name Windows there, the site is from the Russian guy who was also responsible for MP3.com

Originally posted by Gazz+Sep 12 2007, 06:00 AM-->

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